ProductCart Shopping Cart Software Forums : Question for developers about custom price vs ... https://forum.productcart.com/ Copyright (c) 2006-2013 Web Wiz Forums - All Rights Reserved. Fri, 10 Apr 2026 17:33:38 +0000 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:26:48 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.04 360 https://forum.productcart.com/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=3020 <![CDATA[ProductCart Shopping Cart Software Forums]]> https://forum.productcart.com/forum_images/pc_logo_50.png https://forum.productcart.com/ <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Yep. Time to move on. Thread closed. Massimo...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11399.html#11399 Author: ProductCart
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 12:26pm

Yep. Time to move on. Thread closed.

Massimo]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:26:48 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11399.html#11399 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Hi Folks, I don&#039;t know any...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11397.html#11397 Author: Hamish
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 6:48am

Hi Folks,
   I don't know any of the background to this spat & I thank everyone for not naming specific companies or individuals.  I would just like to ask that this thread be wrapped up ASAP as it's not going anywhere useful and is not particular to ProductCart.

]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 06:48:39 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11397.html#11397 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : If every developer in this...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11396.html#11396 Author: JWL
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 6:35am

If every developer in this thread, who has read every one of my posts - thinks that every example I gave is ethical and acceptable behavior, than I owe no one in this thread an apology - because, every one of the examples I gave - if they were to happen... is completely unacceptable - and I gave very detailed reasons for why I believe that to be the case.

You say, I should be ashamed for voicing my concerns about the ethics of developers?  Sir, do you understand that I have every right to object to behavior that I consider unethical or unacceptable or do you think I have to conform to other people's standard of ethics?

You know what, maybe we should just end the thread here - because, obviously we're not gonna see eye to eye on this subject - and I really have no desire to continue addressing ad hominem attacks, when I have done nothing but voice honest concerns.  Thank you.


Edited by JWL - 18-September-2009 at 6:38am]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 06:35:49 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11396.html#11396 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : JWL wrote: You are completely...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11395.html#11395 Author: Guests
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 5:41am

Originally posted by JWL JWL wrote:


You arecompletely misrepresenting this thread.


I do not believe this to be the case, Matt.

Originally posted by JWL JWL wrote:


This thread is directed at developers in general.  I want to discussthe ethics involved in your line of work, and find out what everyoneconsiders acceptable or unacceptable behavior, because honestly -before I started this thread, my impression of developers in generalwas kinda low... so I was hoping that I could ask some questions andhave developers themselves change that impression by letting me knowwhat they consider ethical and unethical.


Are you deaf? The  response from developers on this forum has be RESOUNDINGLY clear.

Maybe you need to take it up on an more general forum as I've suggested. This forum is about ProductCart, not your more general question about developer ethics, etc...

Originally posted by JWL JWL wrote:


After, I received a few replies, which I felt didn't address myquestion - I grew frustrated because I thought maybe my impression ofdevelopers in general is true, but I don't want that to be the case -because I will need to use a developer at some point in time.


Then apologize to the good folks here after you cast a pale on us all. You honestly need to eat some humble pie here, Matt. You were really out of line. Just say you are sorry.  Might help some folks to see you as less caustic down the road here.

Originally posted by JWL JWL wrote:


I started the thread on this forum, because if I do need custom workfor PC in the future, I want to know if there are any developers inthis community who I will feel comfortable working with.


Well, you certainly went about it the wrong way, man! You just pissed everyone off here. Good luck getting anyone to even answer an email for phone call from you now.

Originally posted by JWL JWL wrote:


Trust me, if I need development work for something other than PC, Iwill most surely ask other developers these same series of questions, tofind out whether or not they are someone I want to do business with.


And you will find find the situation the same if you find any good folks there.

I'm not bullsh*tting you here, Matt. I've well over a decade of experience building shopping carts for folks, and over 300 current clients. Greg at GBDG is similar (I've known and collaborated with Greg for about a decade now). The other developer you appear to be slandering here is also top notch. You are seriously NOT making any friends here with the best and the brightest; you're just shooting yourself in the foot, as it were..
]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 05:41:33 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11395.html#11395 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Poisoning the...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11394.html#11394 Author: JWL
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 4:14am

Poisoning the well?  Making myself look poorly?  Making a big fool out of myself?  What?  You arecompletely misrepresenting this thread.  Please, stay on topic and refrain from the ad hominem attacks.  Like I said in my lastcomment, if I do business with a developer and I want the public toknow about my experience than I will leave a review.

This thread is directed at developers in general.  I want to discussthe ethics involved in your line of work, and find out what everyoneconsiders acceptable or unacceptable behavior, because honestly -before I started this thread, my impression of developers in generalwas kinda low... so I was hoping that I could ask some questions andhave developers themselves change that impression by letting me knowwhat they consider ethical and unethical.

After, I received a few replies, which I felt didn't properly address myquestion - I grew frustrated because I thought maybe my impression ofdevelopers in general was true, but I don't want that to be the case -because I will probably need to use a developer at some point in time.

I started the thread on this forum, because if I do need custom workfor PC in the future, I want to know if there are any developers inthis community who I feel, have the same ethical standards as myself.

Trust me, if I need development work for something other than PC, Iwill most surely ask other developers these same series of questions, tofind out whether or not they are someone I want to do business with.


Edited by JWL - 18-September-2009 at 6:55am]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 04:14:22 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11394.html#11394 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Matt,Just give it up, man. You&#039;re...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11393.html#11393 Author: Guests
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 3:28am

Matt,

Just give it up, man. You're just making yourself look poorly here.

If you are honestly interested in what developers may think about your "ethics" question, then you should take that up on a more general forum as I have suggested. Try http://forums.digitalpoint.com/ -- thousands of great folks there from all over the globe. I doubt you'll get a different response than what you found here, though.

Stop poisoning the well, man! There is a great community of merchants, programmers, designers, project managers, etc. here. You are steadily making yourself rather an outcast.

PS: You've caused such a ruckus that there is a lot of buzz about you now behind the scenes. You can pretty much rest assured that none of us will ever touch you with a ten foot pole. So you better start leaning to program; Good luck on that.

PPS: Having learned more about your grievance, I really understand more what Greg posted last night before I had the "inside scoop" on you. You are really out of bounds complaining like this over something you ultimately got for free. You should honestly be ashamed.

PPPS: Just STOP IT with this nonsense. Seriously, man. You're just making yourself look bad here.

PPPS: You'll probaly think I'm just taking sides. I'm not. I'm just seeing someone make a big fool of themselves here -- that'd be you. Quit before you completely incinerate any chance of anyone sensible in this community working with you ever again.

Frankly, I'd suggest that you humble up and apologize before everyone here in hopes that some one will take pity on you in the future.


Edited by Sean@WMS - 18-September-2009 at 3:35am]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 03:28:09 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11393.html#11393 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Is it not possible to have...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11392.html#11392 Author: JWL
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 2:43am

Is it not possible to have an open discussion about the ethics involved in the developer profession without it being turned into some sort of fake drama?  I really want to know what developers consider unethical behavior.

Please, don't read into something that's not there... because it seems like that's what you're doing for some reason.

Also, if I do conduct business with a developer or e-tailer or anyone for that matter, and I want the public to know about my experience than I will write a review, but that's not what this thread is about.

This is a general topic, directed at all developers.  Do you not want to discuss the ethics involved in your line of work?  All I am doing is asking questions, if someone asked questions like this in regard to my profession, I would not hesitate for a second to give them a straight and honest answer.


Edited by JWL - 18-September-2009 at 4:21am]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 02:43:36 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11392.html#11392 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : Just for the record, for the benefit...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11391.html#11391 Author: Guests
Subject: 3020
Posted: 18-September-2009 at 12:50am

Just for the record, for the benefit of the honest ProductCart users who may stumble upon this rant by JWL here -- the developer JWL appaears to be trying to slander here is NOT any of the developers who have responded to this thread. In fact, this developer has a totally SOLID reputation with the rest of the community.

]]> Fri, 18 Sep 2009 00:50:50 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11391.html#11391 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : And, I would just...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11383.html#11383 Author: JWL
Subject: 3020
Posted: 17-September-2009 at 4:33am

And, I would just like to clarify my position because apparently thereis a lot of confusion.  I am NOT saying that there is anything wrongwith reusing code.  I am NOT saying that there is anything wrong withcharging a certain fee for reused code.

The point I am making is a matter of ethics.  Now, let's say you wereto reuse an identical copy/pasted code from a previous project on a newproject.  And, this new client asked you if this code had been usedon another website, and you said, "No, it is new code."  Would you haveany issue with telling that lie?

According to what some have said, a developer can charge any price theywant to, so what would be the benefit in lying to your customer andtelling them it was new code as opposed to copy/pasted code?

There isno point in lying unless there is something to benefit or gain, so if adeveloper did lie about this... what would be their reasoning, sinceaccording to others in this thread - a developer can basically chargewhatever they want regardless if the code is new or reused.

I think this is a much clearer description of the point I am trying to make, soI would appreciate some honest replies in regards to this situation,because I am honestly confounded as to the rationalization behind this type of behavior.

When someone tells me a bald face lie, I feeldeeply disrespected, insulted and exploited.  So, my question is... what would bethe motivation for saying code is new when it's actually copy/pasted code?  Theremust be something to gain, otherwise - there is no need for the lie.

And, one last thing - this has nothing to do with being perfect. Everyone makes mistakes - but, it's one thing to make an honest mistake- and it's another thing to consciously and knowingly lie to a customerin order to achieve some sort of gain.

Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 8:59am]]> Thu, 17 Sep 2009 04:33:34 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11383.html#11383 <![CDATA[Question for developers about custom price vs ... : &#034;Yes, it is entirely appropriate...]]> https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11382.html#11382 Author: JWL
Subject: 3020
Posted: 17-September-2009 at 4:10am

"Yes, it is entirely appropriate - and common - that you will be chargedfor a module despite the fact that someone else may have already beencharged."

Hold on - do you think I'm saying that someone shouldn't pay for a module just because it's been sold before?  Huh?  That's not it at all.  I'm talking about the pricing of the code, and the ethics about calling it custom code as oppose to an already developed module - because that is what determines the price.


Edited by JWL - 17-September-2009 at 5:00am]]> Thu, 17 Sep 2009 04:10:47 +0000 https://forum.productcart.com/question-for-developers-about-custom-price-vs_topic3020_post11382.html#11382